Israelis, has anyone ever met one?

[Alister Scott]

Israeli Spokesman says they had to act as Hamas fighters were using holiday makers for cover!

Not funny I know - it could almost be true.

[BaggyTrousers]

Carlsberg don't do PR but if they did it would probably be the 2nd best PR in the world, after the IDF.

[Dave]

Well said baggy, as the slaughter does continue. Egypt won't negotiate with Hamas as they support the Muslim brotherhood. So there are no peace talks. Hamas are supposed to sign a deal that doesn't offer to lift the blockade. The growing feeling in Gaza is that it would be better to die in dignity then live with none.

[Shan]

There are several Jewish members of the URSC, always found them very likable people but never discussed their views on the Israeli situation.

The situation over there seems to be a seriously up rated version of here in the 70's except the British didn't carpet bomb West Belfast or South Armagh to take out a few extremists. Both sides then were convinced they were right and all snowballed resulting in the ordinary man on the street suffering most.
The rest of the world at that time didn't really have a clue what was going on and I doubt in the situation over there now that we really know what is going on either.

I would say it is closer to events that happened a few hundred years before the 1970's. The world moved on and most states who wanted to operate murder campaigns in the 1970's and later tended to do with far more subtlety. Instead of the state going in and bombing the shíte out of innocent civilians some of their agencies can arrange a few lower profile bombing and murder parties for example and in doing so ensure the spotlight shines where you want it to. Israel doesn't have to care about that because they have the full backing of the yanks and consequently the EU, the two strongest regions economically and politically in the world at present so they can do as they please.

[Russ]

There are several Jewish members of the URSC, always found them very likable people but never discussed their views on the Israeli situation.

The situation over there seems to be a seriously up rated version of here in the 70's except the British didn't carpet bomb West Belfast or South Armagh to take out a few extremists. Both sides then were convinced they were right and all snowballed resulting in the ordinary man on the street suffering most.
The rest of the world at that time didn't really have a clue what was going on and I doubt in the situation over there now that we really know what is going on either.

I would say it is closer to events that happened a few hundred years before the 1970's. The world moved on and most states who wanted to operate murder campaigns in the 1970's and later tended to do with far more subtlety. Instead of the state going in and bombing the shíte out of innocent civilians some of their agencies can arrange a few lower profile bombing and murder parties for example and in doing so ensure the spotlight shines where you want it to. Israel doesn't have to care about that because they have the full backing of the yanks and consequently the EU, the two strongest regions economically and politically in the world at present so they can do as they please.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised who in the Arab world supports who in these arguments too.

Not all are against Israel, some see it as necessary to control the rogue Levant states

Easterby Out

[Dave]

There are several Jewish members of the URSC, always found them very likable people but never discussed their views on the Israeli situation.

The situation over there seems to be a seriously up rated version of here in the 70's except the British didn't carpet bomb West Belfast or South Armagh to take out a few extremists. Both sides then were convinced they were right and all snowballed resulting in the ordinary man on the street suffering most.
The rest of the world at that time didn't really have a clue what was going on and I doubt in the situation over there now that we really know what is going on either.

I would say it is closer to events that happened a few hundred years before the 1970's. The world moved on and most states who wanted to operate murder campaigns in the 1970's and later tended to do with far more subtlety. Instead of the state going in and bombing the shíte out of innocent civilians some of their agencies can arrange a few lower profile bombing and murder parties for example and in doing so ensure the spotlight shines where you want it to. Israel doesn't have to care about that because they have the full backing of the yanks and consequently the EU, the two strongest regions economically and politically in the world at present so they can do as they please.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised who in the Arab world supports who in these arguments too.

Not all are against Israel, some see it as necessary to control the rogue Levant states

Easterby Out

Nothing too pleasant about it but it is rather complicated. Egypt won't speak to Gaza because their Hamas governement support the Muslim brotherhood. Thus locking Hamas out of the negotiations. Iran now won't support Gaza because Hamas support the Syrian rebels. The US support the Syrian rebels but Russia supports Assad. Russia won't back the Israeli's because the US do. And everybody hates the Welsh, even the Russians.

[Russ]

There are several Jewish members of the URSC, always found them very likable people but never discussed their views on the Israeli situation.

The situation over there seems to be a seriously up rated version of here in the 70's except the British didn't carpet bomb West Belfast or South Armagh to take out a few extremists. Both sides then were convinced they were right and all snowballed resulting in the ordinary man on the street suffering most.
The rest of the world at that time didn't really have a clue what was going on and I doubt in the situation over there now that we really know what is going on either.

I would say it is closer to events that happened a few hundred years before the 1970's. The world moved on and most states who wanted to operate murder campaigns in the 1970's and later tended to do with far more subtlety. Instead of the state going in and bombing the shíte out of innocent civilians some of their agencies can arrange a few lower profile bombing and murder parties for example and in doing so ensure the spotlight shines where you want it to. Israel doesn't have to care about that because they have the full backing of the yanks and consequently the EU, the two strongest regions economically and politically in the world at present so they can do as they please.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised who in the Arab world supports who in these arguments too.

Not all are against Israel, some see it as necessary to control the rogue Levant states

Easterby Out

Nothing too pleasant about it but it is rather complicated. Egypt won't speak to Gaza because their Hamas governement support the Muslim brotherhood. Thus locking Hamas out of the negotiations. Iran now won't support Gaza because Hamas support the Syrian rebels. The US support the Syrian rebels but Russia supports Assad. Russia won't back the Israeli's because the US do. And everybody hates the Welsh, even the Russians.

Also look at the GCC

Qatar dumped money into the muslim brotherhood and Hamas, so Saudi, UAE and Bahrain stopped talking to them and thus are saying nothing about Gaza.

Add in the fact that Qatar has full diplomatic relations with Israel due to Israel being the only country able to keep Iran at bay leads to a massive clusterballix

Easterby Out

[Shan]

I think you will be pleasantly surprised who in the Arab world supports who in these arguments too.

Not all are against Israel, some see it as necessary to control the rogue Levant states

Easterby Out

Oh absolutely.

For example I was not in anyway surprised when I heard many years ago that Saudi was the biggest ally of the US in the Middle East. In tandem they have exerted influence and / or control over much of the region for many years. They both get what they want and everybody is happy......except the poor feckers who had to live in countries who had Saudi-appointed leaders.....one of whom was a close acquaintance of mine.

[Pablo]

To answer your question I have met many Israelis who I would describe as ordinary decent people having spent protracted periods in the country. The people I met want nothing more than to peacefully co exist with their neighbours. The problem is they are surrounded by neighbours on every side who seek their obliteration. Hamas are not a merry bunch of freedom fighters struggling against an evil empire. They are a ruthless terrorist grouping who will accept nothing short of Israeli destruction. In Tel Aviv last week I found the vast majority resolute in their support for the strikes on Gaza. They are sick and tired of ongoing attacks that largely go unreported here. Israeli people whom I have known for many years believe if they lay down their weapons there would be no Israel, rather a second holocaust and conversely that If Hamas lay down their weapons there would be no war. I can't disagree with them. There are some parallels with what went on here but I never got the impression that the majority of the good folk south of the border wanted the obliteration of Norn Iron nor the death of every occupant not aligned to their viewpoint.

[TMHG]

I can't be certain but I don't believe I have ever met an Israelie. I wonder has anyone else met one
, particularly a Jewish Israelie?

Yep, I have met a lot travelling in Asia. Universally disliked. Have had many discussions with them - they think that the holocaust justifies everything that they do now. A terrible reputation with the locals for being horrible.

A Chinese guide who worked with a lot of Israelis as she could speak Hebrew told me the following story. Most the guides rely heavily on tips from foreign groups and it is fairly normal that at the end of the tour people would do a collection (about 5 dollars a head) for the guide and bus driver. An Israeli group (having spent 10 days with this guide) actually gave the guide an envelop that they put sheets of paper in as they were being put on a plane.

I've heard similar stories from guides in Nepal. They find them very difficult to deal with.

I've come across jews from elsewhere (like New York etc. and found them to be great people though).

[Pablo]

And us gold old Ulster folk are universally loved big tippers without an anti semetic bone in our well educated bodies!. Must go and tend to my potatoes!

[BaggyTrousers]

To answer your question I have met many Israelis who I would describe as ordinary decent people having spent protracted periods in the country. The people I met want nothing more than to peacefully co exist with their neighbours. The problem is they are surrounded by neighbours on every side who seek their obliteration. Hamas are not a merry bunch of freedom fighters struggling against an evil empire. They are a ruthless terrorist grouping who will accept nothing short of Israeli destruction. In Tel Aviv last week I found the vast majority resolute in their support for the strikes on Gaza. They are sick and tired of ongoing attacks that largely go unreported here. Israeli people whom I have known for many years believe if they lay down their weapons there would be no Israel, rather a second holocaust and conversely that If Hamas lay down their weapons there would be no war. I can't disagree with them. There are some parallels with what went on here but I never got the impression that the majority of the good folk south of the border wanted the obliteration of Norn Iron nor the death of every occupant not aligned to their viewpoint.

Pablo, I don't want to put words in your mouth so instead I'll ask you. Is it fair to characterise you as pro-Israeli irrespective of their actions or have I read too much into your post?

For clarity I don't like Hamas either. I understand that they rule their territory rather like our own beloved terrorist groups, by fear and excessive punishment for those who step out of line. I certainly did not characterise them as merry freedom fighters.

I suspect that there isn't a whole lot to be merry about in Gaza at any time for an ordinary citizen, given Hamas and the iron grip Israel maintains on it, not quite starving them or bringing about a total collapse, just a fraction above that. There most certainly will have been no levity there this past few weeks.

[Jackie Brown]

What about their land grabbing Pablo?

[TMHG]

And us gold old Ulster folk are universally loved big tippers without an anti semetic bone in our well educated bodies!. Must go and tend to my potatoes!

I have never heard as many negative comments about any other nation as I have heard about Israelis. No matter how stingy /poor tippers people can be, it takes being mean to a whole new level doing what that group did.

[Russ]

Time to end the seige ...


... of Gibraltar

Easterby Out