Connacht vs Ulster

[Cornerfleg]

I think in this instance there is room for both of us being correct Merv

[Rooster]

Fitzgibbon as ref will leave 4 points tricky and 5 a downright miracle as it will be difficult to gert the game flowing.

[Russ]

Fitzgibbon as ref will leave 4 points tricky and 5 a downright miracle as it will be difficult to gert the game flowing.

Feck

Still predicting 4

[thegreenlantern]

Dear lord 100 000 sperm and that one was the quickest ....

Up to 500,000,000 tadpoles fleg.

Anything less than 100,000,000 is considered subfertile.

He's talkin about his own sperm count big man.
No wonder she slaps him ha ha ha!!!!

[Neil F]

Its strange Neil that I can recall having a similar debate a while back you said Darcy was selected for Ireland because he was our only option and I had suggested Downey should have been looked at.
You argued that his game was too limited for that level but my point was that you dont know unless you try him out.
Now suddenly when its about Cave you have adopted the dont know unless you try him stance.
Surely not the rose tinted shades on Neil, not from you?
Or have you come around to my way of thinking?

I don't believe it was a good idea to give Downey a chance at international rugby in the last season; Downey is 32, certainly not better than D'Arcy at provincial level and very one-dimensional. If alternatives that are obviously inferior to the incumbent are to be looked at, it must be done with a rationale for what they will contribute in the future. Downey doesn't offer that and he never did offer that. Downey isn't an intelligent player; he's a big strong lad with one dimension and limited pace. He was never a serious alternative to D'Arcy and it would have been pointless trying to make him one. It would have been trying an option for the sake of it, not giving time to a player who might grow into the role.

Cave has been criticised for at least four seasons for a perceived lack of pace. His, potential, inclusion will come at a time when O'Driscoll has hung up his boots and where it is entirely unclear who the heir apparent is. Presuming O'Driscoll calls it a day after this Lions tour, Cave will have at least half a decade of rugby ahead of him - he's just turned 26. Looking around the other provinces, it doesn't seem easy to suggest an alternative to Cave as a potential successor. Earls, to my mind, is very quickly becoming a wasted talent because he absolutely refuses to address the weaknesses in his game; McFadden isn't even assured a start in Leinster's centre, even if O'Driscoll hangs up the boots. Frankly, the only other serious alternatives are Bowe or Luke Marshall moving out to 13 (which, as I've said, is my long-term view, with Olding at 12).

In the absence of O'Driscoll, we are not talking about finding a long-term successor to a declining D'Arcy; we are talking about going from, by some distance, the best outside centre on the island, even now, to players with no real experience in an international centre, or players who have already shown themselves not to be up to the job at that level. In that situation, I find it very bizarre that one would write off Cave for a perceived lack of pace (and no other reason), when he has a decent length of career ahead of him and plays in a position where options are limited and, more importantly, where we simply don't know if he can play around this lack of pace at international level.

Downey isn't a good rugby player; Cave is. There are unanswered questions about whether Cave is an international quality player or not. It was obvious that Downey wasn't and never would be international quality. I find the backlash to a few indifferent performances from Cave recently a little over the top because he's been a model of consistency, otherwise, for three or four seasons at this point; he doesn't need replaced at Ulster and he may offer Ireland, at least temporarily, a pair of safe hands at 13 in the absence of O'Driscoll. Alternatively, his lack of pace could be shown up badly. Who knows?

[ruckover]

Apologies guys, Gilly's absence went straight over my head. Payne to 15, Cave to 13, D'Arcy on the bench.

[big mervyn]

Fitzgibbon as ref will leave 4 points tricky and 5 a downright miracle as it will be difficult to gert the game flowing.

Feck

Still predicting 4

I don't think 4 or 5 points makes a big difference in this game . We'll probably still need to bate Cardiff to top the group. It's all about the win.

[thegreenlantern]

Diss me all ye want but Caver disnae hae the wheels fer the next level and if Ulster want tae get there they need a o/c centre wiy some jets.

Perhaps like Earls?

Cave lacks a certain natural athleticism; I think that has been long established by anyone with any sense. What Cave has done, unlike most rugby players on this island, is find ways to work around his own limitations and in doing so, he has turned into a very fine and rather refined outside centre. He is the best passing centre of the ball in Ireland at the moment and I include the mighty and infallible O'Driscoll in that statement. He is, probably, the most rugby-intelligent player under 30 on the island, as well and by some distance, the smartest in Ulster. An extra yard of pace would see Cave considered in an entirely different bracket than he currently is and yet as a player, he has made the absolute most of his abilities and found ways to mask his limitations. I can't think of many other players on this island who have done that.

In some ways, I think it may hold his international prospects back but the truth is that we simply don't know because we've never seen him play international rugby against a topflight nation and so it is only speculation. Based on what he's done for Ulster in the past three or four seasons, he's worthy of at least the opportunity to succeed O'Driscoll; when you compare to the other options for 13 and the international chances they've been given, it seems baffling that the honest answer about Cave is that we don't know. We can speculate that he doesn't have the pace for international rugby but who actually knows?

If Caver had Earlsys wheels then yeah,but he don't n we all know it, that's all that' s houlin him back.

[Neil F]

What?

Does anyone have a drunk to English dictionary?

[Russ]

Are we allowed to call this a group?

Need WW to rule on this

[Wee Woman]

Are we allowed to call this a group?

Need WW to rule on this

Call what a group?

Kofi seems to be an authority on that, you need to ask him

[Russ]

Someone - think Big Merv, referred to the league as a group - total clusterf*ck

[big mervyn]

Someone - think Big Merv, referred to the league as a group - total clusterf*ck

I was going to argue that, but I've looked, and you're right. It wasn't intentional. You barstewards put it in my head.

[Rooster]

Perhaps Cowboy reads our team thoughts and will chuck in a couple of surprises just to get us all wrong !

[ruckover]

Perhaps Cowboy reads our team thoughts and will chuck in a couple of surprises just to get us all wrong !

If that's what he does then I won't complain - it works!