Ask Anscombe

[bazzaj]

Looks like this debate will rage on and on as Ireland want Payne at 13 and Payne himself wants wants to play there.
As I said a while ago this is the reality that it looks like we will have to accept it regardless of what our opinion is.

I dont doubt that Payne is a quality centre which will increase and strengthen that area but is most effective serving UR as a 15.
That is unless we get a quality replacement at 15 similarly to PJs immergence as a quality 10 which resolved the need to play RP there.

With Kirchener at Leinster having another year to run on his contract would that have implications for us signing an NIQ full back though?
If that is the case it looks like Andrew, Gilroy or maybe even Olding fighting it out at 15 with Payne hopefully playing there when pressed.
I must say the prospect of Olding playing there looks most likely best option and maybe that is the long term plan.
UR have after all shown they are not afraid to throw the youngsters in there over recent years.

[Snipe Watson]

Looks like this debate will rage on and on as Ireland want Payne at 13 and Payne himself wants wants to play there.
As I said a while ago this is the reality that it looks like we will have to accept it regardless of what our opinion is.

I dont doubt that Payne is a quality centre which will increase and strengthen that area but is most effective serving UR as a 15.
That is unless we get a quality replacement at 15 similarly to PJs immergence as a quality 10 which resolved the need to play RP there.

With Kirchener at Leinster having another year to run on his contract would that have implications for us signing an NIQ full back though?
If that is the case it looks like Andrew, Gilroy or maybe even Olding fighting it out at 15 with Payne hopefully playing there when pressed.
I must say the prospect of Olding playing there looks most likely best option and maybe that is the long term plan.
UR have after all shown they are not afraid to throw the youngsters in there over recent years.

Baz have you not been paying atention? Louis Ludik ring a bell?

Here's a revelation:
I don't think Payne is good enough to play 13 for Ireland. I'd have Robbie Henshaw in there ahead of him to be honest.

[BaggyTrousers]

Looks like this debate will rage on and on as Ireland want Payne at 13 and Payne himself wants wants to play there.
As I said a while ago this is the reality that it looks like we will have to accept it regardless of what our opinion is.

I dont doubt that Payne is a quality centre which will increase and strengthen that area but is most effective serving UR as a 15.
That is unless we get a quality replacement at 15 similarly to PJs immergence as a quality 10 which resolved the need to play RP there.

With Kirchener at Leinster having another year to run on his contract would that have implications for us signing an NIQ full back though?
If that is the case it looks like Andrew, Gilroy or maybe even Olding fighting it out at 15 with Payne hopefully playing there when pressed.
I must say the prospect of Olding playing there looks most likely best option and maybe that is the long term plan.
UR have after all shown they are not afraid to throw the youngsters in there over recent years.

Baz have you not been paying atention? Louis Ludik ring a bell?

Here's a revelation:
I don't think Payne is good enough to play 13 for Ireland. I'd have Robbie Henshaw in there ahead of him to be honest.

Here is another revelation, Josef Schmidt told a man of my acquaintance during the early part of the 6 nations that had BOD who was struggling with an injury, was not fit, Darren Cave would have started "because Robbie Henshaw is not ready yet".

Roll on a few months and Cave can now be dispensed with to give Payne time at 13 despite not being available for ArgieTina. As pointed out Cave has no recent injury, is not inconvenienced by his long term shoulder problem which I believe I am right in saying he had before Anscombe arrived at Ulster and if we just think back a little we can debunk further Anscombe trying to blow smoke where the sun don't shine because we have recently been voting in droves for Cave as MOTM.

Sometimes you need to question, does that chime with what I remember? You'll often find your bullshitometre going off more frequently than you might think.

I've thought of a new TV concept. I'll plug it as "When Bullshitters Talk Crap" , you get a variety of minor Hitlers and record them, some talking sense, some lying through their teeth and some just too stupid to know the difference. Then a panel of z list celebrities and a few second rate comedians mull it over and decide, Crap, truth or lies.

Could be a winner, unlike Ulster in the league this year. How can we lose 7 going on 8 matches in this league?

[bazzaj]

Looks like this debate will rage on and on as Ireland want Payne at 13 and Payne himself wants wants to play there.
As I said a while ago this is the reality that it looks like we will have to accept it regardless of what our opinion is.

I dont doubt that Payne is a quality centre which will increase and strengthen that area but is most effective serving UR as a 15.
That is unless we get a quality replacement at 15 similarly to PJs immergence as a quality 10 which resolved the need to play RP there.

With Kirchener at Leinster having another year to run on his contract would that have implications for us signing an NIQ full back though?
If that is the case it looks like Andrew, Gilroy or maybe even Olding fighting it out at 15 with Payne hopefully playing there when pressed.
I must say the prospect of Olding playing there looks most likely best option and maybe that is the long term plan.
UR have after all shown they are not afraid to throw the youngsters in there over recent years.

Baz have you not been paying atention? Louis Ludik ring a bell?

Here's a revelation:
I don't think Payne is good enough to play 13 for Ireland. I'd have Robbie Henshaw in there ahead of him to be honest.

Snipe I am very guilty of not paying any attention and therefore Ludik rings no bells but I take it we have shown an interest in him.
Thanks for drawing this to my attention and it would appear he would fit the profile the player we attract, ie; a quality Saffer and fully signed up member of the God squad.

So Paynes 13 and thats that then really.

To the Bagster, having Cave and Payne is no bad thing and try and look at it as a positive.
Cave can play 12 as well as anyone in our squad I believe and I would not look at this as a negative but healthy competition for places.
For me form should be the determining factor and people like Diack has proved in this squad that if you play well you keep your place over reputation.
The same philosphy with Schmidt in the Irish set up as seen with AT whose international career seemed dead in the water before this season.

We have lost 7/8 matches in my view as I said before because we did not have our best players playing in these fixtures namely Best and RP.
They play in the two specialist positions and without them its a leveller as they give us the edge over most.
Perversely it would give any oppo a lift not to see their names on our team sheet.

I do feel your pain and frustration as it has been like that all season from the sublime to the ridiculous but dont give up mate its not over yet.

[BaggyTrousers]

Jizzer, it's not that I don't think that Cave and Payne might not be a good centre combination, it well might be. My entire argument about Payne at 13 is to do with what we lose at 15 & most importantly what the team loses rather than what one individual gains.

Though he cost us the HC, I am resolute in my belief that Payne is the best full back in the Rabo and arguably in the NH. I do not denigrate his skills in any way indeed it's absolutely because he is such a good full back that this move angers me.

In a nutshell this is probably directed by Joseph, acquiesced to by the player, willingly by the sounds of it, though he surely must know where his own strengths lie, and imposed on Ulster to their detriment. We can't do a damn thing about it, we can voice our displeasure.

[Scranner]

Let me say from the outset that I rate Cave as, possibly, the best 13 in Ireland when BOD retires.

All the talk on this forum assumes that the "Payne to 13 for the sake of Ireland" scenario is a done deal. However, as someone pointed out, both Schmidt and Anscombe appear to select on merit. For too long, Cave has had no-one to really push him for the 13 shirt here at Ulster. Perhaps that is what he needs. Maybe it's along the lines of the iHumph signing, which, IMO, is designed to provide both a SID and a fillip for Paddy to keep him sharp - because I would venture to say that Ian believes he's in with a chance of displacing PJ - even if no-one else does.

[bazzaj]

I think we are all singing off the same hymn sheet here lads though maybe expressing ourselves slightly differently.
It all comes down to what this Ludik fella can bring at 15 if we get him but to be honest I dont know much about him.
If he is any good that will compensate for the loss of Payne playing there.
Dare I say it but I would have liked Lee Byrne the moment Clermont were looking to release him but I suppose the fact he is 33 counts against him as opposed to Ludik who is 27.

[Snipe Watson]

Let me say from the outset that I rate Cave as, possibly, the best 13 in Ireland when BOD retires.

All the talk on this forum assumes that the "Payne to 13 for the sake of Ireland" scenario is a done deal. However, as someone pointed out, both Schmidt and Anscombe appear to select on merit. For too long, Cave has had no-one to really push him for the 13 shirt here at Ulster. Perhaps that is what he needs. Maybe it's along the lines of the iHumph signing, which, IMO, is designed to provide both a SID and a fillip for Paddy to keep him sharp - because I would venture to say that Ian believes he's in with a chance of displacing PJ - even if no-one else does.

I'd say iHumph knows the score well enough. PJ will start at 10 when available. iHumph's tussle will be with Olding, who I think will play 10 during the AIs this year.

[Russ]

Belfast or Reading. Ihumph didn't exactly have a hard choice

Sent from my Brennan