The Big Gay Cake
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
Guest house case is very different AFAIK.
Re: The Big Gay Cake
Not so sure as is it not selling a service as well ?BR wrote:Guest house case is very different AFAIK.
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Rory Best
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
As I remember (and as reported).Rooster wrote:Not so sure as is it not selling a service as well ?BR wrote:Guest house case is very different AFAIK.
Guesthouse refused on basis of perceived sexual preferences, based on the customers' gender/sexuality*.
Ashers refused on basis of political opinion.
*not sure if sexuality was known or implied in that case.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
Curried yoghurt would be ming
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
If you say Riata ... would you just upset the Indians?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
Yes. If Ashers had refused to sell a cake with two wee men on it or say "Seamie loves Sammy" then their wicket would have been stickier imo. The political element muddies the waters.BR wrote:As I remember (and as reported).Rooster wrote:Not so sure as is it not selling a service as well ?BR wrote:Guest house case is very different AFAIK.
Guesthouse refused on basis of perceived sexual preferences, based on the customers' gender/sexuality*.
Ashers refused on basis of political opinion.
*not sure if sexuality was known or implied in that case.
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Big Neville Southall
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
But in what way can it be wrong for Ashers to say "I wont bake you a cake that says support gay marriage as we dont agree with that opinion" yet Peter Robinson and his extreme right wing christian party can state "we will not pass a law that allows gay marriage as we dont agree with it" ??? or even worse "we wont allow gay people to give blood as we dont agree with being gay"
Re: The Big Gay Cake
Was it politics or religious belief they refused to sell the cake on ?big mervyn wrote:Yes. If Ashers had refused to sell a cake with two wee men on it or say "Seamie loves Sammy" then their wicket would have been stickier imo. The political element muddies the waters.BR wrote:As I remember (and as reported).Rooster wrote:Not so sure as is it not selling a service as well ?BR wrote:Guest house case is very different AFAIK.
Guesthouse refused on basis of perceived sexual preferences, based on the customers' gender/sexuality*.
Ashers refused on basis of political opinion.
*not sure if sexuality was known or implied in that case.
“That made me feel very special and underlined to me that Ulster is more than a team, it is a community and a rugby family"
Rory Best
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
Religious grounds I believe.
The fact that same sex marriage is currently illegal here strengthens their case imo. Seems reasonable for them not to print something that contravenes the law as it stands. If they refused to print one celebrating a civil partnership that would be a different matter.
The fact that same sex marriage is currently illegal here strengthens their case imo. Seems reasonable for them not to print something that contravenes the law as it stands. If they refused to print one celebrating a civil partnership that would be a different matter.
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Big Neville Southall
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
... maybe Jane will sue 'em. Can't believe the Queen of cakes hasn't copywrited her moniker.
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Big Neville Southall
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
I'm not sure there is a legal issue if someone advocates something that is currently illegal or else there would be no campaigning at all to change existing laws.big mervyn wrote:Religious grounds I believe.
The fact that same sex marriage is currently illegal here strengthens their case imo. Seems reasonable for them not to print something that contravenes the law as it stands. If they refused to print one celebrating a civil partnership that would be a different matter.
If they wanted the cake to say "Increase maximum speed limit" or "Support legalisation of marijuana" could someone refuse to do this because they disagree with this?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
What if someone wanted a cake with ban gays on it ... could they be refused?
Always ask yourself, "What would Big Rodney do"... And every time the answer is... "Eat It"
Re: The Big Gay Cake
Yes - they could. That is the point. Their opposition was on religous grounds (ie their religious beliefs contradicted the customers political message). Their opposition was not on the grounds of the customers' sexuality. I have to presume they would also have refused my custom if I had asked for the same message.mikerob wrote:I'm not sure there is a legal issue if someone advocates something that is currently illegal or else there would be no campaigning at all to change existing laws.big mervyn wrote:Religious grounds I believe.
The fact that same sex marriage is currently illegal here strengthens their case imo. Seems reasonable for them not to print something that contravenes the law as it stands. If they refused to print one celebrating a civil partnership that would be a different matter.
If they wanted the cake to say "Increase maximum speed limit" or "Support legalisation of marijuana" could someone refuse to do this because they disagree with this?
Re: The Big Gay Cake
I just tried to order a cake with the message, 'Dear Joe, Jared is a 15, good lad'. They refused on religious grounds. They said the word of Joe is not to be questioned. I'm fecking ragin so ah am! I even suggested Ricky Andrew could deliver it to Cartoon house.
I have my own tv channel, what have you got?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake
I think this hits the nail on the head.BR wrote:
Yes - they could. That is the point. Their opposition was on religous grounds (ie their religious beliefs contradicted the customers political message). Their opposition was not on the grounds of the customers' sexuality. I have to presume they would also have refused my custom if I had asked for the same message.
If a straight bloke asks for a cake with 'Support gay marriage' surely they can refuse to support his opinion.
If a gay bloke asks for a cake with 'Support Ulster Rugby' they have no right to refuse him, simply because he is gay.
If a gay bloke asks for a cake with 'Support gay marriage' surely they can refuse on the same basis as the first, but they can't refuse on the basis of the second.
We must support the right of all people to have access to goods and services equally, but if we are policing people's personal beliefs, we're on the road to a bad place.