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The Big Gay Cake

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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BR » Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:36 pm

222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Of course, the gay community are more diverse in their views than their popular portrayal would have you believe. I even know some members who don't have long moustaches, nor wear leather caps!
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby Dave » Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:55 pm

UlsterAreBrill wrote:
Dave wrote:
WeeWorld wrote:
BR wrote:Aye, but sure they're the ones who'd be miserable if they had to actually think for themselves.


Not many really think about this stuff.
People who don't believe in a god are just accepting one of the common beliefs of this time and place.
We are living in what's been called the Age of Doubt which had its beginnings in the 19th century and you might say has gradually taken over our part of the world.
No more credit is due to followers of this belief than to followers of religions in other times/places.
Critical thought, in my view, has evolved through the rejection of 'belief' as an acceptable means of acquiring knowledge. The emergence of the scientific method has set this century and the last apart from previous times. In order to truly accept the the scientific method your starting point must be that we truly know nothing. Certainly in terms of the physical world.

Belief gives you a starting point based on assumption. This creates bias as every observation in the physical world is interpreted in such a way that will reinforce said belief. Disconfirming evidence is likely to be ignored.


So, in other words, you have to believe that you know nothing?
That doesn't require belief more of an acceptance.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby UlsterAreBrill » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:06 pm

Dave wrote:
UlsterAreBrill wrote:
Dave wrote:
WeeWorld wrote:
BR wrote:Aye, but sure they're the ones who'd be miserable if they had to actually think for themselves.


Not many really think about this stuff.
People who don't believe in a god are just accepting one of the common beliefs of this time and place.
We are living in what's been called the Age of Doubt which had its beginnings in the 19th century and you might say has gradually taken over our part of the world.
No more credit is due to followers of this belief than to followers of religions in other times/places.
Critical thought, in my view, has evolved through the rejection of 'belief' as an acceptable means of acquiring knowledge. The emergence of the scientific method has set this century and the last apart from previous times. In order to truly accept the the scientific method your starting point must be that we truly know nothing. Certainly in terms of the physical world.

Belief gives you a starting point based on assumption. This creates bias as every observation in the physical world is interpreted in such a way that will reinforce said belief. Disconfirming evidence is likely to be ignored.


So, in other words, you have to believe that you know nothing?
That doesn't require belief more of an acceptance.


Now that's being pedantic
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby Dave » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:20 pm

UlsterAreBrill wrote:Now that's being pedantic


What did you want me to say?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby big mervyn » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:24 pm

WeeWorld wrote:But my belief in what science says about everything is pretty much entirely based on accepting
what I've been told. I haven't verified any of it, so it's a belief.

Did they not teach science in your school WW?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby 222toHounslow » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:53 pm

BR wrote:
222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Of course, the gay community are more diverse in their views than their popular portrayal would have you believe. I even know some members who don't have long moustaches, nor wear leather caps!


Good for you, what the fûck has that got to do with me or my opinion?
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BR » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:00 pm

222toHounslow wrote:
BR wrote:
222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Of course, the gay community are more diverse in their views than their popular portrayal would have you believe. I even know some members who don't have long moustaches, nor wear leather caps!


Good for you, what the fûck has that got to do with me or my opinion?


Not a thing, but I thought you were deferring your opinion to that of Mr Tatchell.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby big mervyn » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:53 pm

222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Well known Equality Commissioner, theologian and devout Christian, Michael Wardlow is unhappy with the verdict.
Have to say, I can see both sides of the legal argument here. Ashers are still kunts though.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BaggyTrousers » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:22 pm

BR wrote:
222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Of course, the gay community are more diverse in their views than their popular portrayal would have you believe. I even know some members who don't have long moustaches, nor wear leather caps!


:lol: :lol: :lol: >appl
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BaggyTrousers » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:38 pm

big mervyn wrote:
222toHounslow wrote:If well known gay rights campaigner Peter Tatchell is happy with the verdict, who am I to argue.

Well known Equality Commissioner, theologian and devout Christian, Michael Wardlow is unhappy with the verdict.
Have to say, I can see both sides of the legal argument here. Ashers are still kunts though.


My feelings exactly Merv. My fear regarding the decision is and always has been that if this is the end of the matter that all manner of nasty wee ganches will behave like utter kunts to wops, wogs, niggers, jewboys, pakis ragheads, spics, fenians and sundry verminous people who don't look, sound or believe what they believe, and the courts will be full of spides whose sole defence will be that "he is against my religious beliefs so he is".

As for Peter Tatchell, he's a guy I have time for (anyone attempting a citizen's arrest on Robert Mugabe at the peak of his power deserves respect) but no time tonight, so I haven't read his thoughts yet, I'd guess that his approval would be similar to my sons' that this clown Mr Lee and his stunt simply deflect serious consideration of genuine discriminatory troubles that many LGBT people face.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby 222toHounslow » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:50 am

Nail on the head there BT, I think this case has damaged all the previous good work that has gone on and brought people into the debate who previously had no thoughts on the matter, take sides.

The rights of a gay man do not override the rights of every other man.

I like Ashers muffins, that doesn’t mean anything political.

Anyway, that’s me finished with the thread. I’m away to find my leather cap with the chain.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby Rooster » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:48 am

222toHounslow wrote:Nail on the head there BT, I think this case has damaged all the previous good work that has gone on and brought people into the debate who previously had no thoughts on the matter, take sides.

The rights of a gay man do not override the rights of every other man.

I like Ashers muffins, that doesn’t mean anything political.

Anyway, that’s me finished with the thread. I’m away to find my leather cap with the chain.
Can I bring my whip ?

Anyway I had heard the same as your son had thought Baggy, quite a few thought that Lee had driven the gay debate back years by his case and some who actually know him said it was deliberate on his behalf to try and get this stunt off the ground.
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BaggyTrousers » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:27 am

Rooster wrote:
222toHounslow wrote:Nail on the head there BT, I think this case has damaged all the previous good work that has gone on and brought people into the debate who previously had no thoughts on the matter, take sides.

The rights of a gay man do not override the rights of every other man.

I like Ashers muffins, that doesn’t mean anything political.

Anyway, that’s me finished with the thread. I’m away to find my leather cap with the chain.
Can I bring my whip ?

Anyway I had heard the same as your son had thought Baggy, quite a few thought that Lee had driven the gay debate back years by his case and some who actually know him said it was deliberate on his behalf to try and get this stunt off the ground.



I don't doubt that Rooster, my dear friend Kofi told me that before he died and whilst I know he's powerful fond of a wind up, I have no reason not to believe that.

My own feeling that what Ashers did was wrong was largely based on the fact that they had accepted the order and payment and to then decline the order rather than at the point of sale, to me was a clear sign that if not legally discriminatory that it at least paid significant lip service to it.

On reflection, this is very clearly a case with clashing rights of the parties involved, with judges deciding on 3 different occasions whose rights have primacy. What I absolutely dislike about the whole thing is that a can of worms has been opened and numpties will perhaps inflict greater harm by actions which they may interpret as "legally justified", but that may be more seriously discriminatory in areas where it really matters. A cake? How gay. :duh:

As a separate thought, if the Supreme Court decided unanimously, what does that say about the competence of those who previously judged the matter? I suppose judges judge, they are as imperfect as the next man ..........barring two that I know of course who are right on everything. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BaggyTrousers » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:30 am

By the way, I still hope the bakers are consumed by flames. :thumleft:
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Re: The Big Gay Cake

Postby BR » Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:36 am

BaggyTrousers wrote:......barring two that I know of course who are right on everything.


Well looking back, I think I called this one right on page 2. (Although, I have to admit I short-circuited a couple of arguments raised by FETO)
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