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So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Talk about the men in white, and everything Ulster!!

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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Dave » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:53 pm

Kofi Annan wrote:
Dave wrote:Jonno as top dog with someone with someone with experience to help guide the ship. A bit like Lancaster and Cullen.

EOS?

Oh and a defence coach.

Jonno, is he not currently in charge of line outs and say defence at the maul ? Doing great there.
So great we gave him xmas off. Any better ideas?
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby justinr73 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:54 pm

Pat Howard is signed up until the World Cup and Ashes in 2019 when Lehmann is due to pack it in.

That'd only mean another 18 months or so of Les at the helm.
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Cockatrice » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:04 pm

We wasted a year waiting on Kiss...
We wasted a year with Dumb & Dumber in-fighting and that Kiss needed his own team..
Are we now wasting a year on Kiss and his own hand-picked team? ... because we will waste another year with any new coach be it even Gibbes from within.
Our defence is the worst ever apart from last year.. common denominator the defence genius that is Kiss..this year made worse by his changing for changing sake and so many players being played out of position especially in the back line.
Too many average players and not enough SID is still as relevant today as it was 2-3 years ago that and when you sign a player with a serious injury it might come back to bite you if not once more than once..
Cave is not the future but he is in the time of huge absence the present yet overlooked for any other..

For me we have too many layers of management a Head Coach, a DoR, an Operations Manager responsible for contracts amongst other things and a CEO who is lying low having sold the dream..
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Cockatrice » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:10 pm

I still question why we allowed our Head Coach to leave and go home to the other side of the world for Xmas especially at a time of two key local derbies and when we need to get the results. In doing so he missed much of the training involved in these two matches and maybe that was a reflection of the game in Galway and the first half against Munster.

I don't know but how many other top professional sports teams allow their coaches to go home to the other side of the world for Xmas .. Gibbes has lived in Europe for the last several years I had presumed with family or are we facing another Mrs Afoa situation.

further to Kofi... Dundon is our scrum coach were is/was his input to what was a shocking scrum in the past two games (at least)..
Last edited by Cockatrice on Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Rooster » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:11 pm

Kofi Annan wrote:
Dave wrote:Jonno as top dog with someone with someone with experience to help guide the ship. A bit like Lancaster and Cullen.

EOS?

Oh and a defence coach.

Jonno, is he not currently in charge of line outs and say defence at the maul ? Doing great there.
That's what worries me about Jonno, we have gone from one of the best lineouts in the league to one of the worst. Now in his defence we have chopped and changed a lot in the forwards for any stability to materialise
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby 222toHounslow » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:33 pm

I say, give the Nigerian a chance.

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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Neil F » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:41 pm

I can't help but feel the focus on individuals is part of the problem at Ulster. The question is not, for me, about who should replace Kiss when he is put out of his misery but about how the coaching setup should look.

I have no doubt that Kiss has been nothing short of a fecking disaster. He needs to go, and sooner rather than later. Across two equally disastrous seasons, he is the fixed effect. I am realistic about the quality of Ulster's squad and what it can achieve. Despite those limitations, the squad has underachieved in the last two seasons. More telling, perhaps, is that I can't think of another team in Europe that has been so inconsistent in that period, in performance or selection. These problems fall directly at Kiss' door.

That said, Kiss is not to blame for the structure he came into, nor for the frankly bizarre decision to maintain that structure even after the person it seemed specifically designed to accommodate moved elsewhere. Kiss was never a like-for-like replacement, hence the creation of Cunningham's post... The structure is a bloody mess. Therefore, while Kiss needs to go and go soon, it won't matter much in my opinion unless the gap that this creates facilitates a meaningful conversation about the structure of the professional coaching setup. Based on today's interview, this sounds like it comes within Bryn's remit.

As for personnel... I'll base my opinion on Gibbes more on what he's done and achieved in the past than what he has achieved in three months working under Les Kiss... At the same time, Ulster are not, in my opinion, in a place where experiments or risks can be considered. Gibbes might work out to be top notch in the top job but there's no guarantee. Ulster need someone who has a proven track record, at least for a couple of seasons. The Stuart Lancaster role at Leinster, as someone else has suggested, might work but I don't want to see Ulster heading down another convoluted coaching structure. Guys like O'Sullivan, for me, have no place in Ulster therefore - O'Sullivan particularly. I'd say he's a better coach than most on here will give credit; but the apparent power vacuums in Ulster Rugby is exactly the sort of environment in which his scheming will work, to the detriment of all.

If the money saved from Piutau moving on doesn't simply go on plugging a structural gap, Ulster would be better placed investing it in a head coach who is actually a head coach; who has experience in the position; and who has achieved something of note in the game. Richard Cockerill, perhaps, might find Ravenhill's atmosphere preferable to Myreside's...
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby justinr73 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:54 pm

Edinburgh is dead nice though.

Is Mike Ford ruled out because he is a defence coach who played rugby league?

Mallinder has a pretty decent track record.

Both Northern English rather than Northern Irish but, hey, you can't have everything.
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Neil F » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:56 pm

justinr73 wrote:Edinburgh is dead nice though.


I'm sure Ulster could find a way to letting him have a couple of in-season trips to Auld Reekie if he felt like it...
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby justinr73 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:03 pm

Neil F wrote:
justinr73 wrote:Edinburgh is dead nice though.


I'm sure Ulster could find a way to letting him have a couple of in-season trips to Auld Reekie if he felt like it...


I understand that a coaching from home programme via Skype is being trialled between the Wasps and SK matches.
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby UlsterNo9 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:07 pm

Stuart Lancaster in an enhanced role to that which he currently has at Leinster.

He created a conveyor belt of talent when overseeing the RFU youth infrastructure.

The skill levels of Leinsters handling has gone through the roof.

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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby Tender » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:10 pm

Bryn explained at some length, in the Munter program what his job entails. Still a bit of smoke there.
We can't really trust what it says anyway. Check out the teams.

Still unsure about Jonno. Is he impeded by Kissittus( it's as real as man-flu). Could he do the job, with EOS as his assistant? Could we win a trophy? Could Rodders run a 5k? Could it be any wetter? Could it be time to finish up and head home? Could it be real butter? Could it be magic?
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby BaggyTrousers » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:42 pm

Rooster wrote:
Kofi Annan wrote:
Dave wrote:Jonno as top dog with someone with someone with experience to help guide the ship. A bit like Lancaster and Cullen.

EOS?

Oh and a defence coach.

Jonno, is he not currently in charge of line outs and say defence at the maul ? Doing great there.
That's what worries me about Jonno, we have gone from one of the best lineouts in the league to one of the worst. Now in his defence we have chopped and changed a lot in the forwards for any stability to materialise



There are mitigating factors regarding the lineout. In the last lot of seasons we've had Muller, Tuohy & VDM all big men all lineout bankers, we've also had Chief Super Browne who could win a ball, also a big man (vertically), we've also had Rory Best throwing and despite rumour to the contrary, a man with really good consistent stats when throwing to quality jumpers. Add in Hendy and even Chad at the tail every now and again.

This year? Rory 1 start and we have had The Dublin Strangler, a small 2nd row in lineout terms & Tredders also no giant. Hendo hardly back from the Lions/AIs, Coetzee a wreck.

So what his Gibbes had to work with? The guy is a coach, not the facking Messiah. In addition, he has had props falling by the wayside to the extent that he's had fackin' Hond thrice, perhaps the largest ever waste of an NIQ contract ever & that includes whichever of the vast Vetiaki clan who masqueraded as Joeli at £5K per match.

I retain my faith in Gibbes, a half decent pack would undoubtedly help him and if many of them were ever fit at the same time, I suspect we might see something worthwhile.

Meantime I suspect he has done a lot for Timoney, Rea, Dalton, Jones, McBurney and more who have all had big gaps in the squad to fill.

I kept some faith with FOLK until he proved conclusively that he's a fookin' onion, I will accord Gibbes the same.

And whilst I'm at it, some really sharp back play on Monday once they started seeing a bit of ball, maybe Peel to may have something to offer, and I did say that early season, some definite signs when they get the ball.

Defence? The dark chappie in the woodpile. Who does that, do we have an expert?
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby SOU » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:56 pm

Meant to post this the other day, short documentary following Dragons in pre-season and Jackmans arrival! After watching, I'd take ole Bernard in a heartbeat!

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/exclusiv ... ocumentary
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Re: So say the 'noise' gets too loud .... and he goes ....

Postby ulster32 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:11 pm

Having berated Les Kiss myself, I was chatting with a dog whom is very well connected with a senior member of the squad:- The problems lie deeper within the organisation than with Les Kiss, were his words :scratch:
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