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Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Talk about the men in white, and everything Ulster!!

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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby exile-fer-now » Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:35 pm

BaggyTrousers wrote:Sadly no.9 you are as blind to the facts as I was a month ago. Kiss is a huge part of the problem, the dressing room does not respect him, they almost exclusively prefer Doak, and even Clarke is a toss up with Kiss for their regard.

As I said Exile, though not spot on in support of himself/his brother/his son/ his best mate, was not a mile from the truth, Kiss is a fussy wee interfering son of a bitch who thinks he knows more than he does, obstructs those who know a bit more and couldn't pick a dingleberry from his hole never mind a rugby team. This is multisourced information and therefore gospel (or just about conceivably not), sooner or later he will be sacked hopefully before another season is entirely shot through by incompetence.

He's Dublins boy and they don't give a tinker'swank about Ulster, just that whoever they want developed gets developed, if that fits with what is good for Ulster, ok, if not, they have few to zero fecks to give.

I'm preaching here No.9 this is gospel, ask anyone you know who is ITK, Dave will almost certainly confirm the veracity of my spake.

FOLK..... and take yer wee fusty moustache with ye.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Tender » Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:40 pm

Clermont...cast yer minds back, it was great, we ateandshit them.
That was it, the rest was meh.
Les is a plant alright and he loves his own dung. Lou and Cap'n Cavey would have made a hell of an impact in recent games, but sure what do we know?
Another season of broken promises and he can trot out the same platitudes for next season's pre-season, doubtless he'll have this season's summation speech well polished.

'A few things went against us'

'We had a bad run of injuries'

'We'll work really hard to correct those few mistakes'

'The loss of Ruan had a bad affect' ...oh sorry, that's for next season.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby exile-fer-now » Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:55 pm

At last !

I've never said a change/shake up wasn't necessary but Kiss has been completely tactical and has been found out. He's mugged off 2 Ulster men to buy himself a year or 2 and the CEO has let him. I was actually pleased to see Him come in because patently Doak was not No.1 and more a coach. Kiss + Ulster coaches + some fresh ideas may have worked. I'm still hoping Gibbes is a good guy but Kiss is a disaster. You can't spend a year feathering your own nest and take the team down with you. He scapegoated the coaches and the players (e.g. Bowe) and he loses the dressing room for his own self-interest. We need an UlsterMan in the dressing room. I hoped that Bell or Doak would've been supported to have come through to have been a No1. Now we've nobody - we're like a Championship Team bringing in foreign Managers every couple of years. I don't care whether it's Rory or Fez or Big Jim McDonald - we need someone in their who has the Club at heart not their own self-interest. We need someone with a philosophy and strategy not a short term hired gun. I can only hope that Gibbes gets our culture ...... Kiss doesn't.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Tender » Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:13 pm

So, are you saying he's a wee ballix?
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Rooster » Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:32 pm

Tighter End wrote:So, are you saying he's a wee ballix?

Sounds like one in the post match interviews anyway, and if he sounds like one chances are he is one.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Snipe Watson » Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:37 pm

exile-fer-now wrote:At last !

I've never said a change/shake up wasn't necessary but Kiss has been completely tactical and has been found out. He's mugged off 2 Ulster men to buy himself a year or 2 and the CEO has let him. I was actually pleased to see Him come in because patently Doak was not No.1 and more a coach. Kiss + Ulster coaches + some fresh ideas may have worked. I'm still hoping Gibbes is a good guy but Kiss is a disaster. You can't spend a year feathering your own nest and take the team down with you. He scapegoated the coaches and the players (e.g. Bowe) and he loses the dressing room for his own self-interest. We need an UlsterMan in the dressing room. I hoped that Bell or Doak would've been supported to have come through to have been a No1. Now we've nobody - we're like a Championship Team bringing in foreign Managers every couple of years. I don't care whether it's Rory or Fez or Big Jim McDonald - we need someone in their who has the Club at heart not their own self-interest. We need someone with a philosophy and strategy not a short term hired gun. I can only hope that Gibbes gets our culture ...... Kiss doesn't.

Well you're clearly hearing a totally different version events to me.
I suspect you have a vested interest, or is it a family interest, in these shenanigans? Is your surname by any chance Clarke? It is, isn't it?
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Dave » Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:58 pm

I think it's a case of, we (the players) need to get the culture that Jono Gibbes will hopefully cultivate. All Blacks everything.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby UlsterNo9 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:29 pm

Dave wrote:
UlsterNo9 wrote:We are playing more attractive rugby this year than we were last under Doak ball tactics.

If you think this is attractive rugby I'd hate to see your missus.


Why do you think I'm banging your missus Dave? >threaten

I stated more attractive rugby than under Doak, there's a difference.

BaggyTrousers wrote:Sadly no.9 you are as blind to the facts as I was a month ago. Kiss is a huge part of the problem, the dressing room does not respect him, they almost exclusively prefer Doak, and even Clarke is a toss up with Kiss for their regard.

I'm preaching here No.9 this is gospel, ask anyone you know who is ITK, Dave will almost certainly confirm the veracity of my spake.



Baggy I do not claim to be ITK but I'm at least prepared to give Les a season with his own team of coaches. To get rid of him now, well..... this is not soccer. Three years to turn around the mess he inherited should suffice, you have to question where we would be now had Les not arrived and Doak was given the main gig. Perspective please sir, you're a reasonable man.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Rooster » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:05 pm

UlsterNo9 wrote:
Dave wrote:
UlsterNo9 wrote:We are playing more attractive rugby this year than we were last under Doak ball tactics.

If you think this is attractive rugby I'd hate to see your missus.


Why do you think I'm banging your missus Dave? >threaten

I stated more attractive rugby than under Doak, there's a difference.

BaggyTrousers wrote:Sadly no.9 you are as blind to the facts as I was a month ago. Kiss is a huge part of the problem, the dressing room does not respect him, they almost exclusively prefer Doak, and even Clarke is a toss up with Kiss for their regard.

I'm preaching here No.9 this is gospel, ask anyone you know who is ITK, Dave will almost certainly confirm the veracity of my spake.



Baggy I do not claim to be ITK but I'm at least prepared to give Les a season with his own team of coaches. To get rid of him now, well..... this is not soccer. Three years to turn around the mess he inherited should suffice, you have to question where we would be now had Les not arrived and Doak was given the main gig. Perspective please sir, you're a reasonable man.

We were doing better while Doak was in charge :shock:
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby rumncoke » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:07 pm

The problem of being ITK is that everyone has an axe to grind - every change anyone makes will put somebody's nose out of joint - add a mix of players going out of contract ,losing form ,frustrated by injury - you can't please everyone 100% of the time .-- the departing Ruan effect .

At the start of the season the world and his neighbour had the Marshall / Olding centre partnership as going to be the best thing since an Ulster Fry add in the fact that Olding has in 13 games played 12 13 and 10 is it any wonder the defence is fecked then add in the lack of an experienced confident full back organising the defence from behind and a back row that has yet to gel as a unit because it lacks a ferret to clear out the opposition or get over the ball and win possession .

Henderson holds players up and with that in mind tackles high against twisting turning attacking backs the technique provides opportunities to break the tackle or off load .

Baggy conspiracies are frequently the product of imagination and it's too late in an injury affected season to be worthy of consideration .



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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Tender » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:28 pm

A back row which has been dicked with by Kiss for fcuk knows whatever reason.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Rooster » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:42 pm

rumncoke wrote:the fact that Olding has in 13 games played 12 13 and 10 is it any wonder the defence is fecked then add in the lack of an experienced confident full back organising the defence from behind and a back row that has yet to gel as a unit because it lacks a ferret to clear out the opposition or get over the ball and win possession .


You have to ask why Olding has been moved around between 10, 12 and 13 also why the back row gets chopped and changed to the extent the players probably don't know where they are playing next week.
Then there is Stockdale, plays wing from the bench for a while, then when he is scoring trys for fun from there gets moved to centre for a while and last week after not getting a start in ages goes straight in at 15 against Munster, that is neither fair on the lad or the rest of the team.
Those moves around tell me Kiss either has no idea what his best team combinations are or he is following orders from Dublin to play certain players in certain positions.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby rumncoke » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:49 pm

tight that's sh-t the fact is that individual Ross Henderson and Reidy- Henry and even Diack are reasonable players but as a unit they fail. Bar Henderson there isn't a 20 metre ball carrier among them neither is there one who can clear the opposition off the ball or get over it on their own .

There isn't one you could point to and say among them if he 's injured the back row is fecked .

And I include Henderson in that as well because in truth he's a mobile second row rather than an out and out back row 6 .



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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Bart S » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:58 pm

exile-fer-now wrote:At last !

I've never said a change/shake up wasn't necessary but Kiss has been completely tactical and has been found out. He's mugged off 2 Ulster men to buy himself a year or 2 and the CEO has let him. I was actually pleased to see Him come in because patently Doak was not No.1 and more a coach. Kiss + Ulster coaches + some fresh ideas may have worked. I'm still hoping Gibbes is a good guy but Kiss is a disaster. You can't spend a year feathering your own nest and take the team down with you. He scapegoated the coaches and the players (e.g. Bowe) and he loses the dressing room for his own self-interest. We need an UlsterMan in the dressing room. I hoped that Bell or Doak would've been supported to have come through to have been a No1. Now we've nobody - we're like a Championship Team bringing in foreign Managers every couple of years. I don't care whether it's Rory or Fez or Big Jim McDonald - we need someone in their who has the Club at heart not their own self-interest. We need someone with a philosophy and strategy not a short term hired gun. I can only hope that Gibbes gets our culture ...... Kiss doesn't.


What exactly is our culture and why do we need an ulsterman in there? If Doak is good enough then he'll find a way elsewhere to prove himself.
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Re: Les Kiss, Ulster DOR or Dublin Plant?

Postby Bart S » Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:11 pm

Rooster wrote:
rumncoke wrote:the fact that Olding has in 13 games played 12 13 and 10 is it any wonder the defence is fecked then add in the lack of an experienced confident full back organising the defence from behind and a back row that has yet to gel as a unit because it lacks a ferret to clear out the opposition or get over the ball and win possession .


You have to ask why Olding has been moved around between 10, 12 and 13 also why the back row gets chopped and changed to the extent the players probably don't know where they are playing next week.
Then there is Stockdale, plays wing from the bench for a while, then when he is scoring trys for fun from there gets moved to centre for a while and last week after not getting a start in ages goes straight in at 15 against Munster, that is neither fair on the lad or the rest of the team.
Those moves around tell me Kiss either has no idea what his best team combinations are or he is following orders from Dublin to play certain players in certain positions.


Coetzee has hardly played, Henry has been injured a fair amount and Henderson has been managed per the IRFU directive and also given gametime at lock, so our backrow options have been pretty threadbare. Not sure how Kiss or anyone else is supposed to make a stable backrow out of what is left (Reidy plus 2 for a fair chunk of the season).

Olding had to play 10 pretty much out of necessity. Nelson was just back from a very lengthy injury spell and struggling a bit and we had no-one else with PJ away. I'm all for having a go about our lack of strength in depth and in cases such as 10 our lack of anything below PJ bar Ruan, but once we ended up with this Olding was always likely to see some gametime at 10.

On Stockdale, are you 100% sure Ludik was match fit last weekend as if not, who else should have played fullback? As an aside, being shunted from 10 to fullback doesn't seem to be doing Joey Carberry's rugby career much harm.
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